I love the concept -- I've often wished that lean languages like Lua had more support for static typing, especially given the potential performance benefits.
I also love the focus on performance. I'm curious if you've considered using a tail call design for the interpreter. I've found this to be the best way to get good code out of the compiler: https://blog.reverberate.org/2021/04/21/musttail-efficient-i... Unfortunately it's not portable to MSVC.
In that article I show that this technique was able to match Mike Pall's hand-coded assembly for one example he gave of LuaJIT's interpreter. Mike later linked to the article as a new take for how to optimize interpreters: https://github.com/LuaJIT/LuaJIT/issues/716#issuecomment-854...
I did experiment with a few different dispatch methods before settling on the one in Bolt now, though not with tailcalls specifically. The approach I landed on was largely chosen cause it in my testing competes with computed goto solutions while also compiling on msvc, but I'm absolutely open to try other things out.
From my research into the subject the easiest way to implement it would be a 'musttail' macro which falls back to a trampoline for compilers which don't support it. The problem then becomes having the function call overhead (assuming the compiler can't figure out what's going on and do tail-call optimizations anyway) on the unsupported systems with each and every opcode which is probably slower than just a Big Old Switch -- which, apparently, modern compilers are pretty good at optimizing.
The VM I've been poking at is I/O bound so the difference (probably) isn't even measurable over the overhead of reading a file. I went with a pure 'musttail' implementation but didn't do any sort of performance measurements so who knows if it's better or not.
There’s one thing that tail calls do that no other approach to interpreters outside assembly really can, and that is decent register allocation. Current compilers only ever try to allocate registers for a function at a time, and somehow that invariably leads them to do a bad job when given a large blob of a single intepreter function. This is especially true if you don’t isolate your cold paths into separate functions marked uninlineable (and preferably preserve_all or the like). Just look at the assembly and you’ll usually find that it sucks.
(Whether the blob uses computed gotos or loop-switch is less important these days, because Clang [but not GCC] is often smart enough to actually replicate your dispatch in the loop-switch case, avoiding the indirect branch prediction problem that in the past meant computed gotos were preferable. You do need to verify that this optimization actually happens, though, because it can be temperamental sometimes[1].)
By contrast, tail calls with the most important interprerer variables turned into function arguments (that are few enough to fit into registers per the ABI—remember to use regparm or fastcall on x86-32) give the compiler the opportunity to allocate registers for each bytecode’s body separately. This usually allows it to do a much better job, even if putting the cold path out of line is still advisable. (Somehow I’ve never thought to check if it would be helpful to also mark those functions preserve_none on Clang. Seems likely that it would be.)
You may be interested in Luau, which is the gradually-typed dialect of Lua maintained by Roblox. The game Alan Wake 2 also used it for level scripting.
I like 99% of this, and the thing I don't like is in the very first line of the example:
> import abs, epsilon from math
IMHO it's wrong to put the imported symbols first, because the same symbol could come from two different libraries and mean different things. So the library name is pretty important, and putting it last (and burying it after a potentially long list of imported symbols) just feels wrong.
I get that it has a more natural-language vibe this way, but put there's a really good reason that most of the languages I know that put the package/module name first:
import packageName.member; // java
from package import symbol; # python
use Module 'symbol'; # perl
The OP seems to be asking for the Python order of the import statement because it allows for simpler auto-completion when typing it:
from math import square_root as sqrt, abs as absolute
from math import * as not_math
In a format like this, your language service can open up `math` immediately after the `from math` and start auto-completing the various types inside math on the other side of the `import`.
Whereas the `import abs from math` often means you type `import` have no auto-complete for what comes next, maybe type ` from math` then cursor back to after the import to get auto-completion hints.
It's very similar to the arguments about how the SQL syntax is backwards for good auto-complete and a lot of people prefer things like PRQL or C# LINQ that take an approach like `from someTable where color = 'Red' select name` (rather than `select name from someTable where color = 'Red'`).
Put the category first so it makes it easy to skim and sort dependencies. You're never going to organise your dependencies based on what the individual functions, types or sub-packages are called, and sorting based on something that ends up in a more or less random place at the end of a line just seems obtuse.
Oooh, bikeshedding! To me your `import math with x as y` reads like "import all of math, making all of its symbols visible, just renaming some of them". That's different from the intended "from math, import only x (maybe with a renaming)".
This isn't about conflict, it's about how humans read it.
Let's say I have two modules, "telnet" and "ssh", and both have a "connect" function. When I read "import connect, (long list of other imports here)" I don't know which connect it is, and I might form the wrong mental connection, which I then have to revise when I start to read the module name.
FYI "the embedded scene" is likely to be interpreted as "embedded systems" rather than "embedded interpreters" even by people who know about embedded interpreters, especially since all the languages you give as an example have been attempted for use on those targets (micropython, lua, and even typescript)
True. I misread it as being for embedded, especially with the term "real-time" in the mix. Then later when there was no ARM or RISC-V support I became very confused.
I was quite excited by the description and then I noted that Bolt heavily relies on double floating point numbers. I am quite disappointed because this doesn't allow me to use Bolt in my context: embedded systems where floating point numbers are rarely supported... So I realized that I misinterpreted `embedded`.
I appreciate the followup here. The brainfuck interpreter isn't meant to be a benchmark notably, it's a naive implementation for the sake of the example.
I did spot some poor code in the Bolt version of nbody that can be changed (the usage of `.each()` in the hot loop is creating loads of temporary iterators, that's the memory difference.)
luajit -joff does perform better even with this change, but I observe closer to 15% than a 2x difference
Outperforming languages in its class is doing some heavy lifting here. Missing comparison to wasm interpreter, any of the java or dot net interpreters, the MLs, any lisps etc.
Compile to register bytecode is legitimate as a strategy but its not the fast one, as the author knows, so probably shouldn't be branding the language as fast at this point.
It might be a fast language. Hard to tell from a superficial look, depends on how the type system, alias analysis and concurrency models interact. It's not a fast implementation at this point.
> This means functions do not need to dynamically capture their imports, avoiding closure invocations, and are able to linearly address them in the import array instead of making some kind of environment lookup.
That is suspect, could be burning function identifiers into the bytecode directly, not emitting lookups in a table.
Likewise the switch on the end of each instruction is probably the wrong thing, take a look at a function per op, forced tailcalls, with the interpreter state in the argument registers of the machine function call. There's some good notes on that from some wasm interpreters, and some context on why from luajit if you go looking.
The class is "embeddable interpreted scripting language", which is not quite the same thing as just an interpreter.
Embedded interpreters are that designed to be embedded into a c/c++ program (often a game) as a scripting language. They typically have as few dependencies as possible, try to be lightweight and focus on making it really easy to interopt between contexts.
The comparison hits many of the major languages for this usecase. Though it probably should have included mono's interpreter mode, even if nobody really uses it since mono got AoT
This looks so familiar that it got me thinking: who is collating all of the languages that are being invented? I must see two dozen a year on HN. I'm not dissing OP, but I've seen so many languages I'm not sure if I'm having deja vu, or vuja de.
If functions don't have a return signature, does that mean everything must be satisfied in the compilation step?
What about memory management/ownership? This would imply that everything must be copy by value in each function callsite, right? How to use references/pointers? Are they supported?
I like the matchers which look similar to Rust, but I dislike the error handling because it is neither implicit, and neither explicit, and therefore will be painful to debug in larger codebases I'd imagine.
Do you know about Koka? I don't like its syntax choices much but I think that an effect based error type system might integrate nicely with your design choices, especially with matchers as consumers.
I see your benchmarks compare against other interpreted languages "in its class".
We read here a couple days ago about Q which is compiled. Bolt claims to "plow through code at over 500kloc/thread/second". Q claims to compile in milliseconds--so fast that you can treat it like a script.
Bolt and Q are both newborns. Perhaps you could include each other in your benchmarks to give each other a little publicity.
I'm very much in favor of authors choosing unique names for programming languages because there's still plenty of good names up for grabs without having to step on someone's toes. If the project is dead, that's one thing; the data-race one was a research project and hasn't had any activity in 5 years. BOLT last modified in 2014.
But beariish/bolt and boltlang/bolt were started in the same year and are still under active development. With boltlang/bolt obviously snagging the namespace first, I think they should have claim to the name for now. That said, neither seems to have registered any domains, so whoever gets bolt-lang.org/com/net first will probably have an easier time defending a claim.
The only way to have any idea of how long a language might be still around is to look at how long it's been already around. From this perspective , you can only use older languages. The benchmarks show that Lua (and the Luau and Lua+JIT variants) is actually very competitive, so I'd stick with one of those.
In the end, weight is a kind of strength, and popularity is a kind of quality. It looks promising but you can't expect long-term support until there's more contributors and users
At this point it is too early to know. Even JavaScript took like 20 years to catch on
I might be missing this, but I'm not seeing anything about how the type system handles (or doesn't) polymorphism - generics, traits, that sort of thing. Is that in there?
Really impressive, great job! I was interested to see how you had solved Result type and that seems quite developer-friendly—no wrappers just value & error union. I should try it out to see how it's to write if I can run it on ARM64. I wish Godot Script looked like this.
I don't understand why people still choose the syntax `import xxx from yyy` in the current year.
It is a major source of complaining for languages like python or javascript, because it makes autocomplete does not work well.
well the situation may improve, so when one types `log10`, it can just fill in `math`. I tend to remember the function, not the library, so that would work better for me.
so it seems to me you're hung up on the current limitations of the language server, which is an implementation detail.
if what you want is actually important, the syntax should have been `import yyy.xxx as xxx` or similar, with optional `as xxx`, instead of a Cobol inspired syntax detail to remember.
1. Ask - the author is very much available, right here in this comment section they made specifically for such a prospect.
2. Contribute - Code the change you wish to see in the world. Follow the OP’s example, and do something about it.
> It is a major source of complaining for languages like python or javascript
Dynamically typed languages have more difficulties with autocomplete in general, Bolt is statically typed so you shouldn't automatically assume the same difficulties carry over.
Function return type inference is funny but I don't think it's that great of a feature. It makes it harder for a library's consumer to know how to properly use a function, and it also makes it harder for the maintainer to not break backwards compatibility inadvertently. Anyway, I'm all for experimenting.
There's nothing stopping a library author from explicitly annotating return types wherever a stable interface is important, the idea is more for smaller functions or callbacks to make use of this. Perhaps I'll make the examples clearer to reflect the intention.
Perhaps it makes more sense to say that exported function interfaces be explicit. That forces you to document the api and more carefully consider changes.
It’s great in TypeScript. In TypeScript your source can have inferred types returned, and then use a build step to produce resolved typings files (.d.ts) for distribution that have the fully specified type.
Really cool! Roughly how much memory does it take to include it in an engine? Also I'm really interested in the process of creating these really fast scripting languages, have you written anything about how you wrote Bolt?
Bolt's memory usage in most cases hovers right around Lua 5.4/Luau in my own testing, but maybe I should include a few memory benchmarks to highlight that more. It does notably have a higher memory overhead during compilation than other languages in this class though.
As for writeups, I'm working on putting out some material about the creation of Bolt and my learnings now that it's out there.
Seems to be the worst of both worlds: mutable by default, and one must add a "const" keyword to the "let", disincentivizing const behavior by making it super verbose (e.g. the "final" problem from Java)
Super cool! Just now I am building something where I am trying to use mlua to make it scriptable with Lua. But the biggest pain point right now is trying to generate type annotations for LuaLS based on my rust structs. I will look into whether bolt could be interesting for the project.
This looks awesome. Would you have any data on the performance of large number of invocations of small scripts? I am wondering at startup overhead for every script run. which the 500kloc/s may not capture well.
It depends on your exact usecase, I'm not 100% sure what you're asking. There is some overhead for invoking the compiler on a per-script basis. If you're parsing once but running a script many times, Bolt provides some tools (like reusing a preallocated thread object) to ammortize that cost
We have a server which uses Lua based script plugins. They are usually a few hundred to a few thousand lines and get invoked via APIs. I was trying to figure out how Bolt will behave in such a context and whether we could replace the Lua based plugin engine with this.
This is really cool but it's not portable to MacOs or aarm64 yet, and that kind of portability unfortunately is what appeals to me about an embeddable scripting language.
As of right now no - my primary target when developing this was realtime and games in particular since that's what I know best, but if there's a real target in embedded that's certainly something that could be explored.
I love the concept -- I've often wished that lean languages like Lua had more support for static typing, especially given the potential performance benefits.
I also love the focus on performance. I'm curious if you've considered using a tail call design for the interpreter. I've found this to be the best way to get good code out of the compiler: https://blog.reverberate.org/2021/04/21/musttail-efficient-i... Unfortunately it's not portable to MSVC.
In that article I show that this technique was able to match Mike Pall's hand-coded assembly for one example he gave of LuaJIT's interpreter. Mike later linked to the article as a new take for how to optimize interpreters: https://github.com/LuaJIT/LuaJIT/issues/716#issuecomment-854...
Python 3.14 also added support for this style of interpreter dispatch and got a modest performance win from it: https://blog.reverberate.org/2025/02/10/tail-call-updates.ht...
I did experiment with a few different dispatch methods before settling on the one in Bolt now, though not with tailcalls specifically. The approach I landed on was largely chosen cause it in my testing competes with computed goto solutions while also compiling on msvc, but I'm absolutely open to try other things out.
From my research into the subject the easiest way to implement it would be a 'musttail' macro which falls back to a trampoline for compilers which don't support it. The problem then becomes having the function call overhead (assuming the compiler can't figure out what's going on and do tail-call optimizations anyway) on the unsupported systems with each and every opcode which is probably slower than just a Big Old Switch -- which, apparently, modern compilers are pretty good at optimizing.
The VM I've been poking at is I/O bound so the difference (probably) isn't even measurable over the overhead of reading a file. I went with a pure 'musttail' implementation but didn't do any sort of performance measurements so who knows if it's better or not.
There’s one thing that tail calls do that no other approach to interpreters outside assembly really can, and that is decent register allocation. Current compilers only ever try to allocate registers for a function at a time, and somehow that invariably leads them to do a bad job when given a large blob of a single intepreter function. This is especially true if you don’t isolate your cold paths into separate functions marked uninlineable (and preferably preserve_all or the like). Just look at the assembly and you’ll usually find that it sucks.
(Whether the blob uses computed gotos or loop-switch is less important these days, because Clang [but not GCC] is often smart enough to actually replicate your dispatch in the loop-switch case, avoiding the indirect branch prediction problem that in the past meant computed gotos were preferable. You do need to verify that this optimization actually happens, though, because it can be temperamental sometimes[1].)
By contrast, tail calls with the most important interprerer variables turned into function arguments (that are few enough to fit into registers per the ABI—remember to use regparm or fastcall on x86-32) give the compiler the opportunity to allocate registers for each bytecode’s body separately. This usually allows it to do a much better job, even if putting the cold path out of line is still advisable. (Somehow I’ve never thought to check if it would be helpful to also mark those functions preserve_none on Clang. Seems likely that it would be.)
[1] https://blog.nelhage.com/post/cpython-tail-call/
Take look at the Nostradamus Distributor:
http://www.emulators.com/docs/nx25_nostradamus.htm
You may be interested in Luau, which is the gradually-typed dialect of Lua maintained by Roblox. The game Alan Wake 2 also used it for level scripting.
The author seems to be aware as Luau is mentioned in the performance section of the documentation.
I see lua, do you know terralang?
I like 99% of this, and the thing I don't like is in the very first line of the example:
> import abs, epsilon from math
IMHO it's wrong to put the imported symbols first, because the same symbol could come from two different libraries and mean different things. So the library name is pretty important, and putting it last (and burying it after a potentially long list of imported symbols) just feels wrong.
I get that it has a more natural-language vibe this way, but put there's a really good reason that most of the languages I know that put the package/module name first:
With Typescript being the notable exception:Also autocomplete.
Though I almost never manually type out imports manually anymore.
I really like the way Elm does it, from "wide" (package) to "narrow" (symbol). I suspect this also helps language server implementation.
See https://guide.elm-lang.org/webapps/modules (scroll down to "Using Modules") for examples
Do you think approaching the way typescript does it for Bolt is a reasonable compromise here? Bolt already supports full-module renames like
So supporting something along the lines of Would be farily simple to accomplish.The OP seems to be asking for the Python order of the import statement because it allows for simpler auto-completion when typing it:
In a format like this, your language service can open up `math` immediately after the `from math` and start auto-completing the various types inside math on the other side of the `import`.Whereas the `import abs from math` often means you type `import` have no auto-complete for what comes next, maybe type ` from math` then cursor back to after the import to get auto-completion hints.
It's very similar to the arguments about how the SQL syntax is backwards for good auto-complete and a lot of people prefer things like PRQL or C# LINQ that take an approach like `from someTable where color = 'Red' select name` (rather than `select name from someTable where color = 'Red'`).
Why?
Put the category first so it makes it easy to skim and sort dependencies. You're never going to organise your dependencies based on what the individual functions, types or sub-packages are called, and sorting based on something that ends up in a more or less random place at the end of a line just seems obtuse.
Or: `import math with abs as absolute, sqrt as square_root`
Oooh, bikeshedding! To me your `import math with x as y` reads like "import all of math, making all of its symbols visible, just renaming some of them". That's different from the intended "from math, import only x (maybe with a renaming)".
According to the Programming Guide, it supports aliases for imports
"In case of conflict or convenience, you can give modules an alias as well."
This isn't about conflict, it's about how humans read it.
Let's say I have two modules, "telnet" and "ssh", and both have a "connect" function. When I read "import connect, (long list of other imports here)" I don't know which connect it is, and I might form the wrong mental connection, which I then have to revise when I start to read the module name.
can't the compiler process it in reverse?
The compiler doesn’t care either way, this is for the human reader’s benefit.
FYI "the embedded scene" is likely to be interpreted as "embedded systems" rather than "embedded interpreters" even by people who know about embedded interpreters, especially since all the languages you give as an example have been attempted for use on those targets (micropython, lua, and even typescript)
That's a good point, thank you. I've made a small edit to clarify.
True. I misread it as being for embedded, especially with the term "real-time" in the mix. Then later when there was no ARM or RISC-V support I became very confused.
I was quite excited by the description and then I noted that Bolt heavily relies on double floating point numbers. I am quite disappointed because this doesn't allow me to use Bolt in my context: embedded systems where floating point numbers are rarely supported... So I realized that I misinterpreted `embedded`.
Same here! It's very cool but my ideal use case would be on a limited ISA architecture like ESP32.
Bolt doesn’t support ARM or RISC. There’s some comments above re: the confusion with the term “embedded” and “real time”.
I think you might have misread our comments, that is exactly what we are lamenting.
Run some examples, and it looks like this "High-performance, real-time optimized, super-fast" language is
Not bad for version 0.1.0. lua(jit) is no slowpoke and has had decades of performance improvements.
With this and https://github.com/Beariish/bolt/blob/main/doc/Bolt%20Perfor..., it is indeed confusing without testing it out myself.
That said, somehow I do not believe it is faster than LuaJIT. We will see.
I used brainfuck interpreter https://github.com/Beariish/bolt/blob/main/examples/bf.bolt vs lua / luajit implementations from https://github.com/kostya/benchmarks
Just checked with nbody:
I appreciate the followup here. The brainfuck interpreter isn't meant to be a benchmark notably, it's a naive implementation for the sake of the example.
I did spot some poor code in the Bolt version of nbody that can be changed (the usage of `.each()` in the hot loop is creating loads of temporary iterators, that's the memory difference.)
luajit -joff does perform better even with this change, but I observe closer to 15% than a 2x difference
for nbody 500000 on my i5-9300H CPU @ 2.40GHz
Where do you get these numbers from? Looking at https://github.com/Beariish/bolt/blob/main/doc/Bolt%20Perfor... doesn’t seem to support these numbers.
They at least clarified it by saying "outperforming other languages in its class". It's a slow class so the bar is low.
Outperforming languages in its class is doing some heavy lifting here. Missing comparison to wasm interpreter, any of the java or dot net interpreters, the MLs, any lisps etc.
Compile to register bytecode is legitimate as a strategy but its not the fast one, as the author knows, so probably shouldn't be branding the language as fast at this point.
It might be a fast language. Hard to tell from a superficial look, depends on how the type system, alias analysis and concurrency models interact. It's not a fast implementation at this point.
> This means functions do not need to dynamically capture their imports, avoiding closure invocations, and are able to linearly address them in the import array instead of making some kind of environment lookup.
That is suspect, could be burning function identifiers into the bytecode directly, not emitting lookups in a table.
Likewise the switch on the end of each instruction is probably the wrong thing, take a look at a function per op, forced tailcalls, with the interpreter state in the argument registers of the machine function call. There's some good notes on that from some wasm interpreters, and some context on why from luajit if you go looking.
The class is "embeddable interpreted scripting language", which is not quite the same thing as just an interpreter.
Embedded interpreters are that designed to be embedded into a c/c++ program (often a game) as a scripting language. They typically have as few dependencies as possible, try to be lightweight and focus on making it really easy to interopt between contexts.
The comparison hits many of the major languages for this usecase. Though it probably should have included mono's interpreter mode, even if nobody really uses it since mono got AoT
This looks so familiar that it got me thinking: who is collating all of the languages that are being invented? I must see two dozen a year on HN. I'm not dissing OP, but I've seen so many languages I'm not sure if I'm having deja vu, or vuja de.
If functions don't have a return signature, does that mean everything must be satisfied in the compilation step?
What about memory management/ownership? This would imply that everything must be copy by value in each function callsite, right? How to use references/pointers? Are they supported?
I like the matchers which look similar to Rust, but I dislike the error handling because it is neither implicit, and neither explicit, and therefore will be painful to debug in larger codebases I'd imagine.
Do you know about Koka? I don't like its syntax choices much but I think that an effect based error type system might integrate nicely with your design choices, especially with matchers as consumers.
[1] https://koka-lang.github.io/koka/doc/index.html
> If functions don't have a return signature, does that mean everything must be satisfied in the compilation step?
Functions do have a return signature.
It looks like the author chose to show off the feature of return type inference in the short example README code, rather than the explicit case.
https://github.com/Beariish/bolt/blob/main/doc/Bolt%20Progra...
Oh, not OP, but I love Koka. I should play around with it again thanks for reminding me!
I see your benchmarks compare against other interpreted languages "in its class".
We read here a couple days ago about Q which is compiled. Bolt claims to "plow through code at over 500kloc/thread/second". Q claims to compile in milliseconds--so fast that you can treat it like a script.
Bolt and Q are both newborns. Perhaps you could include each other in your benchmarks to give each other a little publicity.
Looks cool, but please can we stop naming things ”bolt”
Yeah this is the third programming language named Bolt that I'm aware of
I'm aware of 4 now. Here are the other 3:
Bolt: a language with in-built data-race freedom! (recent discussion: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=23122973) - https://github.com/mukul-rathi/bolt
Bolt: A programming language for rapid application development - https://github.com/boltlang/Bolt
BOLT: a programming language that was desinged for begining programmers who have never seen code before in their life - https://sourceforge.net/projects/boltprogramming/files
I'm very much in favor of authors choosing unique names for programming languages because there's still plenty of good names up for grabs without having to step on someone's toes. If the project is dead, that's one thing; the data-race one was a research project and hasn't had any activity in 5 years. BOLT last modified in 2014.
But beariish/bolt and boltlang/bolt were started in the same year and are still under active development. With boltlang/bolt obviously snagging the namespace first, I think they should have claim to the name for now. That said, neither seems to have registered any domains, so whoever gets bolt-lang.org/com/net first will probably have an easier time defending a claim.
Not to mention the facebook after compilation optimizer called bolt.
Why repeat JavaScript's mistake of having all numbers be floats, with no integer type? I thought that one's well known by now :(
The question I ask myself when I see this kind of project is: how long are you willing to maintain it for?
My main concern about a new language is not performance, syntax, or features, but long term support and community.
The only way to have any idea of how long a language might be still around is to look at how long it's been already around. From this perspective , you can only use older languages. The benchmarks show that Lua (and the Luau and Lua+JIT variants) is actually very competitive, so I'd stick with one of those.
In the end, weight is a kind of strength, and popularity is a kind of quality. It looks promising but you can't expect long-term support until there's more contributors and users
At this point it is too early to know. Even JavaScript took like 20 years to catch on
Wow a fast scripting language with normal syntax and type checking.. Really hope this can take off and be a valid Lua alternative.
I might be missing this, but I'm not seeing anything about how the type system handles (or doesn't) polymorphism - generics, traits, that sort of thing. Is that in there?
Really impressive, great job! I was interested to see how you had solved Result type and that seems quite developer-friendly—no wrappers just value & error union. I should try it out to see how it's to write if I can run it on ARM64. I wish Godot Script looked like this.
I don't understand why people still choose the syntax `import xxx from yyy` in the current year. It is a major source of complaining for languages like python or javascript, because it makes autocomplete does not work well.
make me instantly lost interest in the language.
well the situation may improve, so when one types `log10`, it can just fill in `math`. I tend to remember the function, not the library, so that would work better for me.
so it seems to me you're hung up on the current limitations of the language server, which is an implementation detail.
if what you want is actually important, the syntax should have been `import yyy.xxx as xxx` or similar, with optional `as xxx`, instead of a Cobol inspired syntax detail to remember.
Two potential suggestions:
1. Ask - the author is very much available, right here in this comment section they made specifically for such a prospect. 2. Contribute - Code the change you wish to see in the world. Follow the OP’s example, and do something about it.
> It is a major source of complaining for languages like python or javascript
Dynamically typed languages have more difficulties with autocomplete in general, Bolt is statically typed so you shouldn't automatically assume the same difficulties carry over.
Function return type inference is funny but I don't think it's that great of a feature. It makes it harder for a library's consumer to know how to properly use a function, and it also makes it harder for the maintainer to not break backwards compatibility inadvertently. Anyway, I'm all for experimenting.
There's nothing stopping a library author from explicitly annotating return types wherever a stable interface is important, the idea is more for smaller functions or callbacks to make use of this. Perhaps I'll make the examples clearer to reflect the intention.
Perhaps it makes more sense to say that exported function interfaces be explicit. That forces you to document the api and more carefully consider changes.
It’s great in TypeScript. In TypeScript your source can have inferred types returned, and then use a build step to produce resolved typings files (.d.ts) for distribution that have the fully specified type.
Ah, true, now that you mention it. I feel like it's the best of both worlds, you get type inference and it gets documented automatically.
Really cool! Roughly how much memory does it take to include it in an engine? Also I'm really interested in the process of creating these really fast scripting languages, have you written anything about how you wrote Bolt?
Bolt's memory usage in most cases hovers right around Lua 5.4/Luau in my own testing, but maybe I should include a few memory benchmarks to highlight that more. It does notably have a higher memory overhead during compilation than other languages in this class though.
As for writeups, I'm working on putting out some material about the creation of Bolt and my learnings now that it's out there.
Looks great, I'm especially a fan of the more C and Python syntax. Lua works, but its syntax has always been bugging me.
On the feature side, is there any support for breakpoints or a debugging server, and if not is it planned?
There's nothing like that right now, but it's absolutely something I want to explore in the future.
Sounds good, this is really one of lua's edge when it comes to feature completeness, so I'm excited at the prospects of this feature for Bolt!
Congrats! I think this could be quite useful for me.
I noticed that `let`-declared variables seem to be mutable. I'd strongly recommend against that. Add a `var` keyword.
Seems to be the worst of both worlds: mutable by default, and one must add a "const" keyword to the "let", disincentivizing const behavior by making it super verbose (e.g. the "final" problem from Java)
https://github.com/Beariish/bolt/blob/0.1.0/doc/Bolt%20Progr...
Super cool! Just now I am building something where I am trying to use mlua to make it scriptable with Lua. But the biggest pain point right now is trying to generate type annotations for LuaLS based on my rust structs. I will look into whether bolt could be interesting for the project.
This looks awesome. Would you have any data on the performance of large number of invocations of small scripts? I am wondering at startup overhead for every script run. which the 500kloc/s may not capture well.
It depends on your exact usecase, I'm not 100% sure what you're asking. There is some overhead for invoking the compiler on a per-script basis. If you're parsing once but running a script many times, Bolt provides some tools (like reusing a preallocated thread object) to ammortize that cost
We have a server which uses Lua based script plugins. They are usually a few hundred to a few thousand lines and get invoked via APIs. I was trying to figure out how Bolt will behave in such a context and whether we could replace the Lua based plugin engine with this.
Looks nice! Is there any plans on a language server and formatting tooling?
Usually I feel like that's bare minimum before I'd like to try and play around with a language
This is really cool but it's not portable to MacOs or aarm64 yet, and that kind of portability unfortunately is what appeals to me about an embeddable scripting language.
Nice language! I am wondering how error handling / exceptions works in bolt?
Quickly scanned the programming guide - but wasn't able to find it. Did i miss a section?
As far as i can see it is simple, everything can return an Error, so you have to check the return value if it is an error.
https://github.com/Beariish/bolt/blob/main/examples/error_ha...
That's definitely not universally true, with even the core library getting into the "null indicates error" game https://github.com/Beariish/bolt/blob/0.1.0/doc/Bolt%20Stand... or this fun middle ground where it could be Error or null https://github.com/Beariish/bolt/blob/0.1.0/doc/Bolt%20Stand...
But I think OP was asking about whatever the hell this means by "native error callback" https://github.com/Beariish/bolt/blob/0.1.0/doc/Bolt%20Stand...
I think I was looking for both error / exception handling within the language and across the C api.
Nice, gives me Pawn vibes
(https://www.compuphase.com/pawn/pawn.htm)
Sounds very good, and I can see many use cases in embedded systems. But that probably requires 32-bit arm support. Is that planned ?
As of right now no - my primary target when developing this was realtime and games in particular since that's what I know best, but if there's a real target in embedded that's certainly something that could be explored.
Looks like I misinterpreted both embedded and real-time then.
It looks cool, I wish you luck in developing the language. I liked your language and I hope it becomes popular someday.
game dev for 15+ years here, love the first example on Github this is compiled right? cannot replace lua?
Bolt is not compiled ahead of time, it's bytecode interpreted just like Lua
It's compiled in the same way that Lua is compiled. So yes, it can replace Lua.
In terms of performance, how does it compare to compiled languages like the C it’s written in?
I took away from benchmarks how fast Luau is...
If I was still writing games I would be alllllll over this
Very cute language ..
.. okay, you got my attention (long-time Lua fan) .. will have to give this some workbench time and learn it ..Awesome.
Is it deterministic like Lua?