I owe Norton a lot of joy for bringing orthodox file managers (the ones with two panes) and I can't live without them. They make file managing so comfortable compared to stuff like Windows Explorer or Nautilus (not saying they are bad though, I just prefer two panes).
Nowadays I mostly use clones like Midnight Commander, Krusader and Double Commander, and I used Worker (a clone of a clone, this time a clone of Directory Opus for the Amiga) for a long time before settling on Krusader as main one. The genealogy of these file managers is kind of fascinating.
I am. My desktop computing has shifted towards fish + vidir, but I use Total Commander for Android on my phone all the time. I have wondered why. What is the difference? Is it just the input method (easier to type shell commands on a physical keyboard)? Well, I don't think so.
The orthodox file manager was created for copying files between two disks. File management on my phone still follows the same pattern: copy or move something between the phone's storage and, for example, an SFTP remote. The remote directories are pretty stable; it makes sense to bookmark them.
Meanwhile, on my computer one-off mass copying has become rare compared to the era of removable media. Most of my mass file operations are moving files to or from a subdirectory in a code project or renaming them. This is an awkward fit for an OFM: you need to go to directory A, duplicate its path to the other pane, switch to the other pane, and then navigate up or down a level to directory B. A dynamic "parent directory" or "../foo/" second pane might help.
I haven't used many of the others, but I love Midnight Commander! Especially after enabling "Lynx-like motion" - it's so nice being able to walk around directories with arrow keys
We were using Volkov Commander because it was much smaller (and single-file executable IIRC). I tried Dos Navigator and FAR but these did too much for my liking. In the Windows XP era Windows/Total Commander was in style locally.
> They make file managing so comfortable compared to stuff like Windows Explorer or Nautilus (not saying they are bad though, I just prefer two panes).
When I’m on Windows and need two panes, I open two Windows Explorer windows.
It's not just about two independent panes. It's about two panes in a single context. With this, there can be shortcuts that act in files and which now don't just have a source (the selected files in the active pane) but also a destination (the inactive pane), so copying, symlinking and moving all can be done with a single key without the need to provide a destination.
Two explorer windows are independent of each other. Any move or copy requires two keyboard actions or the use of the mouse
You could in principle setup shortcuts the same way (treat right tab/second window as the automatic destination), but that'd definitely be more error prone vs a built-in dependency
I'm using 'mc' on Linux from time to time and total commander on my mobile with the sftp plugin. Still remember Norton from back in the days this way ;-)
Totalcmd on windows. On Mac I’m using some off-brand klone that’s kinda ok but uses like 1GB of memory per instance window. Mac OS is such a shit show these days.
I came to Unix from an MS-DOS background, where I used Norton Commander a lot. I used to keep an older version of NC – which would fit on a floppy – with me at all times. But on Unix, I ended up not using any of the clones; not even Midnight Commander, which was a key-for key clone, and should have fit me perfectly. It turns out you, or at least I, just don’t use Unix the same way as I did MS-DOS. When I need to manipulate files in any quantity, I use Emacs and its dired-mode.
See especially the “wdired-change-to-wdired-mode” command, now available on the usual “toggle read-only mode” keystroke C-x C-q – it’s magical.
I use one of its descendants, Total Commander, every day. It's one of the few applications I actually paid for, it's that critical for my daily computer usage.
What I love about it is that you get lifetime free updates.
I suspect that the author got setup for life selling it and instead of cashing out and selling it to some bigcorp (who undoubtedly would've changed the free update policy) he decided to keep the updates free forever.
I suggest its clone, Double Commander. Does everything as TC, supports its plugins and is cross platform and open source. I was very active in TC community until I switched to DC.
Growing up in the 90s, Norton Commander had this aura of mystery around it.
A lot of people I've met believed that it was a separate operating system. For example, I remember asking a friend "Did your computer had DOS in the beginning?" and he replied "Even worse, Norton."
My mom found me once aimlessly using my cousin's computer and she was shocked to discover I had opened Norton Commander (unintentionally of course) and told me "you know if you delete that, you'll delete all programs in the system" (passing over the absurdity of the claim itself, even then I didn't understand how opening it will make it more probable to delete it).
Not being Anglophone, even the name "Norton" sounded a bit dangerous, like something radioactive I guess.
Anyway afterwards when we got our own computer I pieced together what Norton actually was and the aura disappeared.
I am always amazed looking at tools like Norton Commander or Visicalc that invented a ton of concepts we now view as totally normal and just as the way things are. Same for a lot of programming concepts. The world could look totally different if some people had been better at selling their ideas.
I owe Norton a lot of joy for bringing orthodox file managers (the ones with two panes) and I can't live without them. They make file managing so comfortable compared to stuff like Windows Explorer or Nautilus (not saying they are bad though, I just prefer two panes).
Nowadays I mostly use clones like Midnight Commander, Krusader and Double Commander, and I used Worker (a clone of a clone, this time a clone of Directory Opus for the Amiga) for a long time before settling on Krusader as main one. The genealogy of these file managers is kind of fascinating.
Anyone else a fan?
I am. My desktop computing has shifted towards fish + vidir, but I use Total Commander for Android on my phone all the time. I have wondered why. What is the difference? Is it just the input method (easier to type shell commands on a physical keyboard)? Well, I don't think so.
The orthodox file manager was created for copying files between two disks. File management on my phone still follows the same pattern: copy or move something between the phone's storage and, for example, an SFTP remote. The remote directories are pretty stable; it makes sense to bookmark them.
Meanwhile, on my computer one-off mass copying has become rare compared to the era of removable media. Most of my mass file operations are moving files to or from a subdirectory in a code project or renaming them. This is an awkward fit for an OFM: you need to go to directory A, duplicate its path to the other pane, switch to the other pane, and then navigate up or down a level to directory B. A dynamic "parent directory" or "../foo/" second pane might help.
I haven't used many of the others, but I love Midnight Commander! Especially after enabling "Lynx-like motion" - it's so nice being able to walk around directories with arrow keys
We were using Volkov Commander because it was much smaller (and single-file executable IIRC). I tried Dos Navigator and FAR but these did too much for my liking. In the Windows XP era Windows/Total Commander was in style locally.
> They make file managing so comfortable compared to stuff like Windows Explorer or Nautilus (not saying they are bad though, I just prefer two panes).
When I’m on Windows and need two panes, I open two Windows Explorer windows.
It's not just about two independent panes. It's about two panes in a single context. With this, there can be shortcuts that act in files and which now don't just have a source (the selected files in the active pane) but also a destination (the inactive pane), so copying, symlinking and moving all can be done with a single key without the need to provide a destination.
Two explorer windows are independent of each other. Any move or copy requires two keyboard actions or the use of the mouse
You could in principle setup shortcuts the same way (treat right tab/second window as the automatic destination), but that'd definitely be more error prone vs a built-in dependency
Absolutely not. After the 90's I don't see a point of forcing or limiting oneself to working with two folders at a time.
I'm using 'mc' on Linux from time to time and total commander on my mobile with the sftp plugin. Still remember Norton from back in the days this way ;-)
>and total commander on my mobile with the sftp plugin.
I think you may mean Ghost Commander, I use it on Android and it fits your description.
Why? Total Commander for Android is a thing.
Does this work well? I had a colleague who swore by it on account of it having (some) NTFS-capability by way of a plug-in.
Didn't know there was a Total Commander for Android. I use Ghost Commander which is nice and also has a SFTP plugin, but I'll have to check TC out!
Total Commander for Android has plugins for ftp(s), sftp, smb (windows shares), webdav, dropbox, gdrive.
https://www.ghisler.com/androidapp.htm
https://www.ghisler.com/androidplugins/googleplay/
Totalcmd on windows. On Mac I’m using some off-brand klone that’s kinda ok but uses like 1GB of memory per instance window. Mac OS is such a shit show these days.
A fan of optional 2-pane views, which unfortunately many of these file managers fail in providing, insisting on it being the only available option
I came to Unix from an MS-DOS background, where I used Norton Commander a lot. I used to keep an older version of NC – which would fit on a floppy – with me at all times. But on Unix, I ended up not using any of the clones; not even Midnight Commander, which was a key-for key clone, and should have fit me perfectly. It turns out you, or at least I, just don’t use Unix the same way as I did MS-DOS. When I need to manipulate files in any quantity, I use Emacs and its dired-mode.
See especially the “wdired-change-to-wdired-mode” command, now available on the usual “toggle read-only mode” keystroke C-x C-q – it’s magical.
(This has been an 11 year old repost of <https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9474384>.)
I use one of its descendants, Total Commander, every day. It's one of the few applications I actually paid for, it's that critical for my daily computer usage.
What I love about it is that you get lifetime free updates.
I suspect that the author got setup for life selling it and instead of cashing out and selling it to some bigcorp (who undoubtedly would've changed the free update policy) he decided to keep the updates free forever.
I suggest its clone, Double Commander. Does everything as TC, supports its plugins and is cross platform and open source. I was very active in TC community until I switched to DC.
Yes, I know about it and it's good. But since I already paid for TC the only reason for me to use it is that there's a Linux version, which is nice.
Is it possible to show a dialog at startup that waits until I press one of the 1-2-3 buttons?
Of course. How can you even ask that.
Growing up in the 90s, Norton Commander had this aura of mystery around it.
A lot of people I've met believed that it was a separate operating system. For example, I remember asking a friend "Did your computer had DOS in the beginning?" and he replied "Even worse, Norton."
My mom found me once aimlessly using my cousin's computer and she was shocked to discover I had opened Norton Commander (unintentionally of course) and told me "you know if you delete that, you'll delete all programs in the system" (passing over the absurdity of the claim itself, even then I didn't understand how opening it will make it more probable to delete it).
Not being Anglophone, even the name "Norton" sounded a bit dangerous, like something radioactive I guess.
Anyway afterwards when we got our own computer I pieced together what Norton actually was and the aura disappeared.
I was an Amiga kid, so Directory Opus was my Norton Commander. I still use Directory Opus on Windows to this day
I didn't grow up with the Amiga, but I tried some Directory Opus clones and loved them. I need to try the original one sometime!
I am always amazed looking at tools like Norton Commander or Visicalc that invented a ton of concepts we now view as totally normal and just as the way things are. Same for a lot of programming concepts. The world could look totally different if some people had been better at selling their ideas.
Norton Commander set me on the path to building Gusco: https://intestinate.com/gusco/
NC tribute theme included.
Give it a shot if you wish Midnight Commander felt closer to Total Commander.
I remember when Total Commander (originally Windows Commander) arrived and immediately made NC on Windows obsolete.
Symantec really knew how to trash a good product.
While I haven't had to deal with Windows professionally for a very long time, I still miss the feel of Total Commander and DOS NC.
Never heard of Gusco before, looks interesting. I'm adding it to my collection!
Does anyone remember their disk deframenter?
I had Gemini implement a simulation:
https://chrissherlock.github.io/operating-system/week10-file...